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Kevin4762
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Kevin4762
2,420 posts
Nomad

Since I just saw the Socialism thread stray into universal healthcare, I wanted to put it here.

How does universal have a negative effect on people?

  • 89 Replies
NoNameC68
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NoNameC68
5,043 posts
Shepherd

They don't work. They just collect money from the government.


Well there you have it, you don't understand how a free market works.

Then what is? If the government is so rich, then why do we have a government deficit?


The problem is we rely on a government that can only create debt.

I think Libertarians are the biggest trolls. lol

Most people who do go to universities earn $1 million more than people who don't. What does that say? To become rich, you need to be rich.

It's a vicious cycle.


I know, it sucks, if only schools could compete with one another.

Not as gifts, but its purposes.


I think they are a rip off.

What? The government gave bailed out companies so that it would hire workers and those companies just stuffed the money in their pockets and ran away.


I'm done debating. You should know by now that I don't support bail outs.
NoNameC68
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NoNameC68
5,043 posts
Shepherd

Also, please watch my video on how to fix health care. Kthanksbai.

Kevin4762
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Kevin4762
2,420 posts
Nomad

Well there you have it, you don't understand how a free market works.


So by saying that CEOs sit on their at *** smoking a $3 000 pack of cigars, that means I have no idea how a free market works?

That makes perfect sense.
The problem is we rely on a government that can only create debt.


How does the government do this? Did the government give out huge loans to people who weren't qualified for it? Did the government charge 30% tax on credit cards? Did the government foreclose thousands of houses across the nation?

I know, it sucks, if only schools could compete with one another.


How is that relevant?
I think they are a rip off.


You just proved that gift cards (companies) are ripoffs. Why spend money on something that you can get for free?
I'm done debating. You should know by now that I don't support bail outs.


Why? Because it proves that companies don't hire workers and that trickle down theory is a bunch of lies?
NoNameC68
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NoNameC68
5,043 posts
Shepherd

When they pay their taxes. And that money is for all. NoName, you try to raise a special needs child who requires extensive medical treatment as a single parent while trying to juggle a job.

You try to be a full time student, living by yourself and holding down a minimum wage job.


Make friends, work hard, be smart.

Morality should not be guided by gunpoint. If you think everyone should help each other, forcing them to pay is not the answer. It causes debt, monopolies, and increased market prices since government kills competition.

You just proved that gift cards (companies) are ripoffs. Why spend money on something that you can get for free?


Gift cards are a rip off, so I don't buy them. Nobody is forcing me to buy that gift card.

I'm done debating. You should know by now that I don't support bail outs.


No, I'm done debating because I'm talking about a free market. I do not support bailouts, yet you insist on acting like I support bailouts. You assume that Americans live in a free market and that I'm defending the way things are, we don't and I'm not. I advocate a true free market.

If I have problems in life, I don't demand a higher authority to take from someone else. I work out my problems. I seek people who can help me and I repay them in one way or another. In a capitalist society with a true free market, everyone has more money in which they can help each other with.

We have gotten absolutely nowhere what-so-ever.
Kevin4762
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Kevin4762
2,420 posts
Nomad

No, I'm done debating because I'm talking about a free market. I do not support bailouts, yet you insist on acting like I support bailouts.


http://29.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_ldp3jukzHo1qb9a2wo1_500.png

You quoted yourself. Who exactly are you arguing against?
wolf1991
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wolf1991
3,437 posts
Farmer

The problem is you completely disregard another's arguments because they do not match your own point of view. You're infuriating to debate with because to you all are inferior, and anything outside your perspective must be wrong. You over simplify and assume too much. Your arguments are simply "Too bad, I did so can you." such standards cannot be held up in a real life situation.

Not everyone is the same, not everyone is capable of dealing with things the way you believe they should be dealt with. We're not advocating that the government should do everything, we're simply supporting a system we believe to be beneficial to a nation. For you to disregard our opinions and beliefs is the height of arrogance.

You and I have discussed this particular issue in the past, so I do not believe I need to remind you of how successful UHC is around the world. Also, UHC does not always cover everything, there is often still a private sector.

Kevin4762
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Kevin4762
2,420 posts
Nomad

The problem is you completely disregard another's arguments because they do not match your own point of view. You're infuriating to debate with because to you all are inferior, and anything outside your perspective must be wrong. You over simplify and assume too much. Your arguments are simply "Too bad, I did so can you." such standards cannot be held up in a real life situation.

Not everyone is the same, not everyone is capable of dealing with things the way you believe they should be dealt with. We're not advocating that the government should do everything, we're simply supporting a system we believe to be beneficial to a nation. For you to disregard our opinions and beliefs is the height of arrogance.

You and I have discussed this particular issue in the past, so I do not believe I need to remind you of how successful UHC is around the world. Also, UHC does not always cover everything, there is often still a private sector.


Bailouts prove that trickle down theory don't work, don't you get it?

Whether you like it or not, it proves it doesn't work. Why? Because the rich don't become so rich that they magically explode and they rain money. You have to force it out of them.
wolf1991
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wolf1991
3,437 posts
Farmer

Um Kevin...my post was directed at NoName.

ChillzMaster
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ChillzMaster
1,434 posts
Nomad

And why didn't you go to school? Because you weren't able to pay for it, and maybe your grades weren't that great."



education is FREE up to college, moron!
qwerty1011
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qwerty1011
554 posts
Peasant

When they pay their taxes. And that money is for all. NoName, you try to raise a special needs child who requires extensive medical treatment as a single parent while trying to juggle a job.

You try to be a full time student, living by yourself and holding down a minimum wage job.

You sir, are why communionsim will always exist. For the worker grows tired of giving his labor to an uncaring master, who cares not if he lives or dies.


OK, there are people like you say who actually deserve help but some people just can't be bothered to work and live off benefits and they don't deserve it.
Krizaz
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Krizaz
2,399 posts
Nomad

Universal healthcare is just one step closer to communism, a system where everything is provided to the people who can give no effort into their occupation, leaving the nation in a state of suspended animation, never progressing, and being left in the dust of its rivals


Are you saying that just about every single 1st world country is communist because it believes that all people should have equal rights in some form?

My horse is amazing.


You are just being ignorant in saying that you dont care about other people at all, it's selfish and extremely annoying to read something as ignorant as this.
Einfach
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Einfach
1,448 posts
Nomad

How does universal have a negative effect on people?

Universal healthcare, we will define it as so: The government provides insurance for people who cannot afford it. At first glance, it looks good - people will be able to have health insurance that they would not have otherwise. However, you're not taking into account what could have been done with the money. If in the taxpayers' hands, that same amount of capital could have been used for other means. Surely there is a huge psychological advantage to this, because we only see the effect that the Universal Healthcare had on people - we never get to see the effect of the extra capital on peoples' lives.

So it stops being a question of "Are the immediate effects of the policy of Universal Healthcare good?" and it becomes the question of "Is the public policy of Universal Healthcare better than private industry?"

Now notice that there is inevitably more waste in the government-run business.

Government has no real incentive to operate in an efficient way like regular business.

Businesses have to compete with other businesses, and in a capitalistic free market, they have to use their own money. Government, however, isn't risking their own money - they're risking the taxpayers.

Inevitably, Government-provided Healthcare has an overall negative effect compared to the alternative: allow a capitalistic free market.
Einfach
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Einfach
1,448 posts
Nomad

When was the last time you donated money NoName? The people who hold the idea that welfare is wrong because they are using other people's money don't donate for the same reason.

Actually, I heard a stat one time that said that those in favor of the free market donate both more money and a larger percentage of it.
Source:
http://www.realclearpolitics.com/articles/2008/03/conservatives_more_liberal_giv.html
Einfach
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Einfach
1,448 posts
Nomad

What Noname forgets is, not everyone has the same high paying job he has and can't simply stroll into a doctor's office and pay the $300+ bill right out of pocket.

Actually, you still pay for it, either way, whether it's government-run or run by businesses.
wolf1991
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wolf1991
3,437 posts
Farmer

education is FREE up to college, moron!


I was refering to any post secondary institute, thank you very much.
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