ForumsWEPRGay Parents and Their Children

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Asherlee
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Asherlee
5,001 posts
Shepherd

This topic was spurred from the Gay Marriage topic.

Introduction
Gay couples all over the world adopt or have children of their own. This topic is going to initiate debate on some of the presented issues with gay parenting and the implications it might or might not have on the children. Please leave all the comments out like: "It's wrong because God say so."

The issues I am going to list below are a mix of irrational and rational concerns. Please remember that.

Issues

1. The children of gay parents will end up being gay.
2. The children will experience heavy turmoil in school.
3. Lesbians do not have enough "maternal" instincts to be a mother.
4. Gay couples do not have all the "right" tools to be parents.

Please discuss some of these issues (though some are so stupid it is funny).

Info I will contribute

Below is some info I have snagged from a few reputable sites.

Beliefs that lesbian and gay adults are not fit parents likewise have no empirical foundation (Anderssen, Amlie, & Ytteroy, 2002; Brewaeys & van Hall, 1997; Parks, 1998; Patterson, 2000; Patterson & Chan, 1996; Perrin, 2002; Stacey & Biblarz, 2001; Tasker, 1999; Victor & Fish, 1995). Lesbian and heterosexual women have not been found to differ markedly either in their overall mental health or in their approaches to child rearing (Bos et al., 2004; Kweskin & Cook, 1982; Lyons, 1983; Miller, Jacobsen, & Bigner, 1981; Mucklow & Phelan, 1979; Pagelow, 1980; Parks, 1998; Patterson, 2001; Rand, Graham, & Rawlings, 1982; Siegenthaler & Bigner, 2000; Thompson, McCandless, & Strickland, 1971). Similarly, lesbians' romantic and sexual relationships with other women have not been found to detract from their ability to care for their children (Bos et al., 2004; Chan et al., 1998b; Pagelow, 1980). Lesbian couples who are parenting together have most often been found to divide household and family labor relatively evenly and to report satisfaction with their couple relationships (Bos et al., 2004; Brewaeys et al., 1997; Chan, et al., 1998a; Ciano-Boyce & Shelley-Sireci, 2002; Hand, 1991; Johnson & O'Connor, 2002; Koepke, Hare, & Moran, 1992; Osterweil, 1991; Patterson, 1995a; Sullivan, 1996; Tasker & Golombok, 1998; Vanfraussen, Ponjaert-Kristoffersen, & Brewaeys, 2003). Research on gay fathers likewise suggests that they are likely to divide the work involved in child care relatively evenly and that they are happy with their couple relationships (Johnson & O'Connor, 2002; McPherson, 1993).

The results of some studies suggest that lesbian mothers' and gay fathers' parenting skills may be superior to those of matched heterosexual couples. For instance, Flaks, Fischer, Masterpasqua, and Joseph (1995) reported that lesbian couples' parenting awareness skills were stronger than those of heterosexual couples. This was attributed to greater parenting awareness among lesbian nonbiological mothers than among heterosexual fathers. In one study, Brewaeys and her colleagues (1997) likewise reported more favorable patterns of parent-child interaction among lesbian as compared to heterosexual parents, but in another, they found greater similarities (Vanfraussen, Ponjaert-Kristoffersen, & Brewaeys, 2003). A recent study of 256 lesbian and gay parent families found that, in contrast to patterns characterizing the majority of American parents, very few lesbian and gay parents reported any use of physical punishment (such as spanking) as a disciplinary technique; instead, they were likely to report use of positive techniques such as reasoning (Johnson & O'Connor, 2002). Certainly, research has found no reasons to believe lesbian mothers or gay fathers to be unfit parents (Armesto, 2002; Barret & Robinson, 1990; Bigner & Bozett, 1990; Bigner & Jacobsen, 1989a, 1989b; Bos et al., 2003, 2004; Bozett, 1980, 1989; Patterson, 1997; Patterson & Chan, 1996; Sbordone, 1993; Tasker & Golombok, 1997; Victor & Fish, 1995; Weston, 1991). On the contrary, results of research suggest that lesbian and gay parents are as likely as heterosexual parents to provide supportive home environments for children.

The bulk of evidence to date indicates that children raised by gay and lesbian parents are no more likely to become homosexual than children raised by heterosexuals. As one researcher put it, "If heterosexual parenting is insufficient to ensure that children will also be heterosexual, then there is no reason to conclude that children of homosexuals also will be gay".

Studies asking the children of gay fathers to express their sexual orientation showed the majority of children to be heterosexual, with the proportion of gay offspring similar to that of a random sample of the population. An assessment of more than 300 children born to gay or lesbian parents in 12 different samples shows no evidence of "significant disturbances of any kind in the development of sexual identity among these individuals."

Courts have expressed concern that children raised by gay and lesbian parents may have difficulties with their personal and psychological development, self-esteem, and social and peer relationships. Because of this concern, researchers have focused on children's development in gay and lesbian families.

The studies conclude that children of gay or lesbian parents are no different than their counterparts raised by heterosexual parents. In "Children of Lesbian and Gay Parents," a 1992 article in Child Development, Charlotte Patterson states, "Despite dire predictions about children based on well-known theories of psychosocial development, and despite the accumulation of a substantial body of research investigating these issues, not a single study has found children of gay or lesbian parents to be disadvantaged in any significant respect relative to children of heterosexual parents."

Psychiatrist Laurintine Fromm, of the Institute of Pennsylvania Hospital, agrees with that finding. "[The] literature...does not indicate that these children fare any worse [than those of heterosexual parents] in any area of psychological development or sexual identity formation. A parent's capacity to be respectful and supportive of the child's autonomy and to maintain her own intimate attachments, far outweighs the influence of the parent's sexual orientation alone."

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Midnightday
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Midnightday
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Nomad

i think gayness is just wrong and i personally feel very sorry for them because i wonder what they think about i mean its not like they can talk to their parents lol (=[/quote]

I'm not sure what you mean. Children of a young age don't have any prejudices agaisnt anyone. Prejudice is the taught behavior. Homosexuality isn't. I'm sure it would be tough for you since you seem to be very judgemental of love but I guess that's just you.

America is just getting worse! First the Government lets gays marry, then lets them adopt kidz! Then they raise another generation of Gays.[/quote]

Straight couples have been doing this since the start of human existance.
Don't be ignorant.

Actually Xcalibur45 to me you seem to be the reason America is getting worse. Some people just need a group of people to hate. Jews, African Americans. And now this. Do a couple of more gay teenagers need to get shot in the head at school or hung on a tree before people realize the huge mistake we as a society are making?

I know the holocaust and the civil rights movement were very radical, violent, and full of hard and hateful time. And now isn't as horrible. But still, people get bullied, hurt, and murdered.

"According to the FBI, 14 percent of hate crimes in 2005 were motivated by sexual orientation bias. This means that gay people â" or people perceived to be gay â" are disproportionately the victims of these terrible crimes. Although the FBI doesn't track anti-transgender hate crimes (something that would be fixed if the LLEHCPA becomes law), we do know transgender people suffer from greatly disproportionate numbers of violent hate crimes as well. Anti-LGBT violence is not a new problem, but one which has existed for years". http://www.thetaskforce.org/issues/hate_crimes_main_page/2007_legislation
(im not sure about the correct citation but that's where i got this from)

TotalReview
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TotalReview
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Shepherd

Ash, I know you don't follow most of these but I am just doing this to respond to all of the previous posts.

1. The children of gay parents will end up being gay.


The children of straight parents have ended up gay. I don't see why people think that. There are better gay parents then straight parents. People are so ignorant now-a-days.

2. The children will experience heavy turmoil in school.


Once again, children experience turmoil when they have straight parents. There are many homophobes out there though so this could cause some hatred towards the child. It is sad but true.

3. Lesbians do not have enough "maternal" instincts to be a mother.


This point is just ridiculous in my opinion. Anyone that agreed to this is not open-minded. It is up to the person if they will love and care for their child. It does not matter what gender they like. As long as a woman loves her child and cares for them, they are a good parent.

4. Gay couples do not have all the "right" tools to be parents.


There are straight couples who go through rough patches. Sometimes straight couples can not be good parents. This does not mean all gay couples will be good parents either. Basically, it is up to the parents to decide if they are ready.

Summary of my points: Why should gay and straight parents be viewed at differently?
TotalReview
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TotalReview
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Shepherd

i feel bhad for the kids,they probaly get mulested or something,gay marrige should be kept out of the usa


You are an asshole. There are many straight men/women who molest little children. Ever notice how many men molest little girls? Yeah, that is a straight rape. How dare you insult all gays based on what may happen sometimes just like how it sometimes happens with straights.
daswiftarrow
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daswiftarrow
873 posts
Nomad

im gonna have to agree with TotalReveiw on the posts hes made, just because your gay doesnt mean your a bad parent

Carlie
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Carlie
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Blacksmith

I agree with TotalReview. I am shocked at the amount of insensitivity and ignorance that is going around on this topic. What makes anyone think that gay parents would be any different than straight parents? There are many heterosexual couples that verbally and physically abuse their children. There are many kids that live in loveless household. Yet, somehow living with an abusive heterosexual couple is worse than living in a loving homosexual household? Please, explain to me how that is worse.

TotalReview
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TotalReview
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Shepherd

im gonna have to agree with TotalReveiw on the posts hes made, just because your gay doesnt mean your a bad parent


Exactly. It doesn't matter what gender a parent is, they can be a good parent if they try. People say gay couples don't let their kids have enough fatherly or motherly influence. There are straight couples where the mom or dad runs off and the kids are left without that influence yet those kids are looked at as "normal".

I agree with TotalReview. I am shocked at the amount of insensitivity and ignorance that is going around on this topic. What makes anyone think that gay parents would be any different than straight parents? There are many heterosexual couples that verbally and physically abuse their children. There are many kids that live in loveless household. Yet, somehow living with an abusive heterosexual couple is worse than living in a loving homosexual household? Please, explain to me how that is worse.


I wish there were more good people like you, Carlie and anyone else that agrees. The problem I believe is we live in this &quoterfect" world. Well, we think we do. If you are different in any way, you are disrespected and looked at as a terrible person. Really, if you don't like homosexuals, you shouldn't take that out on the kid along with the parents.
daswiftarrow
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daswiftarrow
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Nomad

Seriously it could make since that gay parents tend to be better, ill quote this from sxephil on youtube "i envy the gay, i have a gay friend and him and his partner play halo for 3 hours, how cool would that be?!" its that gay people have closer interests while diffrent genders tend to have totally different opinions and ideas

Asherlee
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Asherlee
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Shepherd

TR, I love what you wrote. You are always insightful on topics and present your arguments well whether you disagree or agree. Kudos! Same for Carlie!

Arrow, that is a cool point to bring up. I was in a few relationships with men in the past and I never once had such a great one as I do now. My girlfriend and I are different, but we share so many more things together and that brings us closer together. Not to mention we understand each other better than a man and woman would. (In my opinion).

Carlie
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Carlie
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Blacksmith

Er, Carlie, I think you meant that the other way around 8D

Yea, sorry! I meant better, not worse.
Strop
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Strop
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Bard

Yet, somehow living with an abusive heterosexual couple is worse than living in a loving homosexual household?


Er, Carlie, I think you meant that the other way around 8D

Not to mention we understand each other better than a man and woman would. (In my opinion).


Tangentially, this raises the issue of the normative judgement of how large a factor the 'degree of understanding' should be in a relationship, given the proliferation of literature of "men are from Mars, women are from Venus" etc. Once again I simply point back to my criticisms of such normative ethics and suggest that we should start actively thinking about broadening the scope of relationship models.

I know this scares conservatives because it tends to rock the apparent stability of their world but let's face it- one's need for such stability is a bit of a delusion.
Asherlee
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Asherlee
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Shepherd

Strop, I agree. But isn't having relationship models in the first place kind of an endless task anyway? Let's say we have broadened the models to extend to non-traditional families. From there we would have more models, but eventually more non-traditionals. Yes?

TotalReview
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TotalReview
803 posts
Shepherd

TR, I love what you wrote. You are always insightful on topics and present your arguments well whether you disagree or agree. Kudos! Same for Carlie!


Wow, thanks a lot, Ash. I just present my reason and don't follow what everyone else says.I have a mind of my own and I use it. I see so many people fake an opinion just to go with the crowd.

gay people have closer interests while diffrent genders tend to have totally different opinions and ideas


Really, this can be said the same for both sides. There may be gay people who like sports while others like soap operas. I am just saying that you can't immediately think the same gender will have the same interests. It would be like saying a gothic person and a preppy person have the same interests even if they were the same gender.

Like I have said before, we are all different. There are good and bad straight couples. There are good and bad gay couples. It amazes me that we exile gay couples even though both kinds have pros and cons.
Strop
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Strop
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Bard

But isn't having relationship models in the first place kind of an endless task anyway? Let's say we have broadened the models to extend to non-traditional families. From there we would have more models, but eventually more non-traditionals. Yes?


That'd be the idea...I just think it'd work better if we stopped pretending that the very fabric of social operation depended on our conforming to these antiquated standards that are themselves associated with the kind of lifestyles and infrastructure that we can't sustain for much longer anyhow.
SpartanWarrior3
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SpartanWarrior3
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Nomad

I failed to read what everyone else wrote about the topic. So I will just give my views on the subject. I think if a kid grows up with two gay parents, it will effect them all in different ways. Say the kid is a boy, and has two dads I think in the longrun he will become more soft, emotional, and get crap in school for being a fag.(even if hes not) Say it's a girl, and has two moms, I think she will learn to become more caring, nice, and view the world as an equal place. I dunno to much on the subject so idk.

Asherlee
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Asherlee
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Shepherd

I failed to read what everyone else wrote about the topic.


Well, you should have. Your argument doesn't stand and can be defeated by reading the other posts. That is the entire point of the forum.
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