This news will upset some of you. This news will gladden some of you. This news may be met with a "this issue is dragging on far too much" by most of the rest of you.
Being gay, isn't a small detail, having a zit on your face is a small detail. Being gay effects your whole life, what people think about you, your social life, and so on. It's a life changing detail.
Somewhere earlier I said since many relationships nowadays have people having sex and living together anyway, and since gay couples can't have kids, they don't have any added responsbilities with marriage.
You know, besides the pressures of being persecuted. Also, I might add that I'm getting rather tired of the "kids are the reason for marriage" deal. There's plenty of kids who need to be adopted, and I know that many, many gay couples out there are looking to adopt.
Being gay, isn't a small detail, having a zit on your face is a small detail. Being gay effects your whole life, what people think about you, your social life, and so on. It's a life changing detail.
It isn't a small detail but the founding fathers wouldn't want any U.S citizen persecuted for being who they are. The whole point they founded the nation was to obtain the freedoms that they were being denied under the rule of a nation that couldn't identify with them. They went into the Revolutionary War because they believed people should be allowed to choose how they live their lives and the government should support the people.
On another note it is a life altering detail but only to them, it effects the rest of the world in no way. Instead of denying them rights people should be more empathetic to their situation. If they're happy the way they are and since they don't hurt anyone what is the problem?
Woah, close minded? seriously? it's 2 guys...where the hell is this world going?
Because they're two males/females it breaks down reality? Give me a break. I'd rather put my trust in people who are willing to be honest, even against all this adversity, as opposed to the people who feel the need to put others below themselves. I really hate it when someone preaches about the Bible and then spits on the Ten Commandments. Of the two the I'd take the Commandments any day of the week.
So marriage doesn't merge their relationship anyway.
The argument I'm seeing is that if you aren't religious, and live and sleep together, then what's the point getting married right?
To counter this, why do you not oppose straight atheist couples from getting married for this very reason? 80% of Britain's consider themselevs atheist, yet they get married all the time and recieve no stick at all for doing so. As soon as gays want to be treated equally they are shunned.
Why bother?
Why does it bother you if they want to get married? People's rights shouldn't be restricted because of opinion.
Yeah, but we're not making slaves out of them, we're telling them not to get married.
I was making the point that during Jim Crow times, the KKK issued many statemenets saying things just like ,'blacks don't choose to black anymore than a dog chooses to be a dog.....but let's just persecute them anyway!'
There's a financial crsis going on. The Taleban are 60 miles away from nuclear weapons in Pakistan, the challenge of climate change is looming and yet this is still a big issue? Some Americans need to get over their conservatism and confront the real issues of the day instead of getting hung up on topics that shouldn't even be up for debate in a free, fair, civilised nation.
Because they're two males/females it breaks down reality?
Not just that, but it violates the laws of causality and causes a rift in the space-time continuum.
Now that I've finished taking the piss, I remember kicking this off yesterday and I think Firefly has (given that I haven't read the posts from page 3 onwards) finally stated the real point here: how come this is still an issue in our circumstances?
I would have been happier had this thread gone largely unnoticed.
GAGAMEN: less flame please, I've already told you once but figured maybe you chose not to read the private message I left you. So this time I'm publicly stating it.
Why can't we live in the world our founding fathers wanted? To be treated fairly and to live in god's world: A wonderful world.
You couldn't have contradicted yourself more.
First of all, probably about 100 years ago, if you were gay and people knew it people would probably make fun of you, beat you up, just flat out ignore you. You would be thought of as a weird, screwed up person. So do you really think that our founding father, wayyy back in the 1800's would have accepted gays? Openly gay people that weren't thought of as weird probably all started in the 60's and 70's with the hippys and the whole "free love" movement.
And I believe you also said in Gods world?
Haha ridiculous. It states in the bible that laying with another man is a sin. It is also a sin according to the church. God doesn't want gay marriages. People are probably going to ask "well why did he put gay people on earth?" Answer: he didn't. Its all our own choices of free will.
I personally don't agree with gays, but I wouldn't say that I'm a gay basher, I'd explain my views further but I am short on time.
Actually in this case, I think they would persecute them.
Perhaps, but their reasoning behind doing so would probably have been to the effect that a fledgling nation couldn't handle the stress that an open minded homosexuality policy would provide in a largely Christian world. Not to mention the internal struggle that the citizens would fight could have caused a serious rift back in those early days. They desired unity more than a lot of things back then because unlike today, states seceding from the country was a real threat.
But we're beyond that now, we're supposed to be a better nation than that. We've incorporated all kinds of new concepts to adapt to a changing world. Why is gay marriage one that we just can't accept?
FireflyIV made a good point too. How bad do things have to get before people take their minds off of who marries who? I really think that there are more important things that we could use all this energy to resolve.
Somewhere earlier I said since many relationships nowadays have people having sex and living together anyway, and since gay couples can't have kids, they don't have any added responsbilities with marriage. You can respond to that if you want, but I'm probably not going to debate this because it's not the most important issue to me (since I'm against, anyway).
Then sterile marriages or marriages that do not end up with cildren are ewually as wrong. If you compare the 'reasons' for gay marriage to be illegal, they are all either totalitarian or religious. This is a representative republic gov't that is supposed to not make laws respecting an establishment of religion, and keeping gay marrigae illegal goes against all of those values. -------------
Founding fathers would of participated in the hanging of gays lol
How the hell is that funny?
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Its all our own choices of free will.
Did you ever choose to be hetero? It is a choice in that they would always be homosexual, but would make the choice to only be romantically involvedh the same sex after not feeling an attraction toward the opposite. Homosexuality is not a choice. Open homosexuality is.
