Why do half the people who visit the WEPR forums smear Christianity? Why don't you people realize that, yeah, Christians can be real dumb-a** mofo's from time to time, but yet there are many, many Christian organizations out there that do good all across the globe. Why must you spend your time trying to convince people that Christians are bad people when that is simply not true?
Not trying to say Christians are bad. The religion does have some moral points, however the text often contradicts these moral points and even hold immoral things up as moral. Also many of the good things these Christian organizations do often come with strings attached. For instance they may go over and use donated money to feed hungry children, but will also take some of that money off the top to buy Bibles so they can preach to these same people.
I focus mostly on Christianity since I live in a place that is heavily Christian and I have to deal with that religion constantly trying to force itself on me such as through laws.
If christians left people alone, and didn't tell people "your going to hell you rotten sinner!" (Had that said to me more then once) they might not have such a bad name.
Also, they impact laws, such as abortion, and gay marriage. tey push to make both of them illegal, when it really shouldn't be up to one religious group to do so.
Furthermore, they seem to be as a whole ignorant. If I'm trying to get a point across, not relating to god, they say things like "well In the bible...*something the probably isn't in the bible, but some preacher said it to them*....so therefor your wrong".
...That in addition to what wolf said. <3 you wolf.
Not trying to say Christians are bad. The religion does have some moral points, however the text often contradicts these moral points and even hold immoral things up as moral. Also many of the good things these Christian organizations do often come with strings attached. For instance they may go over and use donated money to feed hungry children, but will also take some of that money off the top to buy Bibles so they can preach to these same people.
Isn't the inverse exactly exactly true as well. There are a lot of decent Atheist or secular organization that do plenty of good that take donations of money and use it for to feed hunger people, but they might take some of the money off the top to buy pamphlets and use them to promote Atheism.
It's what one looks at as negative and positive. What was the good what was the bad? To stand for one thing don't you kind of have to be against another?
Look, I'm an Atheist. I don't mean to argue against one religion more than any other but the majority of people I argue against are Christian. If you wanna call pointing out flaws and fallacies in their logic and in the Bible 'smearing' then so be it.
The only Cristians on AG that end up getting smeared are the ones that lose it after being completely defeated in an arguement about god. And its not that they get smeared because they are Christian, its because they get ticked off and start cursing and verbally attacking people. I'm also an atheist (like the majority of AG) but like any sensible person I do not smear people because of their religion. I'll do it cause they're acting like ******s.
I'm also an atheist (like the majority of AG) but like any sensible person I do not smear people because of their religion. I'll do it cause they're acting like ******s.
But, why smear them at all? They're already proving themselves to be ******s.
Statements like your religion is stupid, a crutch, waste of time, are insulting and don't hold any weight. To say, "I think this... is stupid because..." seems more useful in a debate and not insulting. Of course if you just say I think this... is stupid because look how silly and dumb it is", still doesn't give much a reason to why it was said, aside from using it to give your opinion and insult other people.
I'm Christian and although I try and stay out of WEPR as much as possible, I'm just going to butt in now and say Christians have done alot of ****, but so has everyone else. Whether it's because they're taking donations to buy bibles as Wolf said, or casting a bad light on other Religions, every single Religion has done it, as well as all the atheists (even on AG, which is what this thread is for. Yay for relevance ).
I also find people have a very cynical and negative view of Christianity. Most won't force you to mass every weekend and I've never met or heard anyone saying anything like "You're going to hell for being a sinner".
Statements like your religion is stupid, a crutch, waste of time, are insulting and don't hold any weight.
Wait, I didn't say anything was stupid (is this directed at me?). Anyway, I rarely see anyone call someone's religion stupid, they just call it wrong and based on no evidence. Then they call the person who follows it stupid. Regardless, people should be allowed to give critisism of religion to point out its flaws so long as there is logical reason for the critisism and so long as its done in a polite manner. The problem is that people get so passionate about their own beleifs that they start calling other ones "stupid", which as you said is just insulting.
In general most of the frequent debaters on here don't smear, they debate. Unfortunately, debates over religion often escalate to fights in which both sides smear the other.
Because people see the extremes and generalize to the rest of us Christians.
Everyone generalizes, I don't believe in God but I'm sure I know more about what God is supposed to be, how to worship him, how to act in church, how to debate for Christianity, etc. than the majority of Christians do. Heck I could probably get more people to convert than most Christians could.
There are a lot of decent Atheist or secular organization that do plenty of good that take donations of money and use it for to feed hunger people, but they might take some of the money off the top to buy pamphlets and use them to promote Atheism.
Wait...what?! Atheism is NOT a religion, it's a belief that there is no higher power. And since it is NOT a religion there's nothing to preach or promote. I have yet to see an atheist who says "You need to stop believing in God because he isn't real, because science says so!" I have seen Atheists assert logic as to why they believe God isn't real, but that isn't the same thing. However, the only Atheists who would promote Atheism would be those who think science is some magical new religion, in which case they're not atheists, they're mentally deficient. Science is based solely upon rationality.
Sheesh... is this all that you can argue about? Being nit-picky grannies getting upset all about mistakes that people make from time to time? Yes, Christians, like anyone, makes mistakes. They are not perfect nor is anyone for that matter. Furthermore, not everyone who claims to be a Christian is genuinely one; many times and all through out history, there have been people walking under the banner of Christianity but don't actually follow the guidelines nor do they strive for a relationship with God.
I know that those who are like what I just mention can say very rash things and seem like jerks, but have you thought about asking, "Then why don't you show me the way?" when they say, "You're a sinner so you're going to rot in hell!" Have any of you ever asked them why they believe such things? If you haven't than there is no purpose complaining about what they just said. If you have, then you shouldn't be complaining.
Why is it that the credibility of the Bible has been argued for so many years when the Magna Carta was never put up for discussion? Or the Declaration of Independance? The Bible has been around for far longer than either of those articles of writing, and the Bible went through harder tests, parameters, debates, and criteria than those articles ever were! Yet, the debate of the truth of the Bible still remains... why?
many times and all through out history, there have been people walking under the banner of Christianity but don't actually follow the guidelines nor do they strive for a relationship with God.
Like the majority of Medieval and Rennaisance Popes for example?
have you thought about asking, "Then why don't you show me the way?"
No because I believe them to be wrong and ignorant of the flaws within their own system. And upon further discusion they often are. If they're not I have no reason to convert because in the end I believe there is no God, and therefore I believe them to be wrong, so what would be the point of them "showing me the way"?
Why is it that the credibility of the Bible has been argued for so many years when the Magna Carta was never put up for discussion? Or the Declaration of Independance?
Because the Bible has a tendency to contradict itself. The Magna Carta was something forced upon King John through a series of rebelions by the barons of England. The Barons then drew up the Magna Carta, which granted the common man more freedom and forced John to sign and carry it out. Fyrthermore the Magna Carta is no longer enforced, so it's moot to criticize. The Declaration of Independence falls under constant scruitiny, thus why it keeps changing to this day.
The Bible has been around for far longer than either of those articles of writing, and the Bible went through harder tests, parameters, debates, and criteria than those articles ever were! Yet, the debate of the truth of the Bible still remains... why?
Your idea of "tests" for the Bible include taking the Torah and several other books written for Judasim, call it the Old Testament, then have over three hundred books written on the life of an obscure historical figure who very well may have been a schizophrenic; have a council of Romans debate the validity of these books and destroy or remove anything that does not call Jesus the son of God, and then preach this to a Roman Empire on the brink of colapse. THEN we have the various mistranslations, archaic meanings, numerous conradictions and a Church that has known more corruption than any other political entity in the world...and you expect the bible to be taken seriously?
Like the majority of Medieval and Rennaisance Popes for example?
Sure... but they were under the banner of Catholicism were they not?
No because I believe them to be wrong and ignorant of the flaws within their own system. And upon further discusion they often are. If they're not I have no reason to convert because in the end I believe there is no God, and therefore I believe them to be wrong, so what would be the point of them "showing me the way"?
Then why are you complaining?
Because the Bible has a tendency to contradict itself.
Give me five examples and I will refute each and every one.
The Declaration of Independence falls under constant scruitiny, thus why it keeps changing to this day.
Don't you mean the Bill of Rights? The D of I only changed once and that was when Congress edited quite a few things from the original manuscript.
Your idea of "tests" for the Bible include taking the Torah and several other books written for Judasim, call it the Old Testament, then have over three hundred books written on the life of an obscure historical figure who very well may have been a schizophrenic; have a council of Romans debate the validity of these books and destroy or remove anything that does not call Jesus the son of God, and then preach this to a Roman Empire on the brink of colapse.
Do you know nothing of Church History? Do you not know of the Council of Nicea? Nor the thousands of books and letters and papers written that the disciples and apostles went through to narrow it down to actually get the New Testament?!?
and a Church that has known more corruption than any other political entity in the world...and you expect the bible to be taken seriously?
And yet the Church remains! And the Roman empire who went through crazed Emperors, power hungry kings, and greedy senators and fell. The Church has gone through harder things than any political entity be it personal matters and persecution, but has survived through all the ages and will for many more years.
Finally I want to ask you, if Atheism was persecuted as Christianity was in the Roman times, would you die for it? Would you give you life for a belief that there is nothing beyond death? Further, I want to ask you, how do you think this world came about? And don't give me, "The big bang... dur!" where did those gases that caused it come from? And from whatever your answer is, where did that come from? Once you're done answer that, would you agree that nothing was just... "there" from the beginning of time?
