ForumsWEPREvolution in Schools?

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indianaford
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indianaford
10 posts
Nomad

I think evolution should not be taught in schools. I am a Christian, and I believe in intelligent design. I think I speak for all Christians when I say that evolution should not be taught as fact in schools.

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Ichibon
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Ichibon
136 posts
Peasant

What amazes me is that if you believ it isn't real, than do what others do in this case, study it yourself. See if you can find answers to back evolution for yourself. If you can't, than why don't you just realize that you have you own belief structure and stop trying to tell someone how wrong they are.

It is possible to believe in something without always proving others wrong just to satisfy you own ego. No offense and all, I'm just saying that you can't disprove something without having knowledge of the topic first.

Flipski
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Flipski
623 posts
Nomad

Evolution is not real because its a theory? Its completely obvious that micro-evolution exists.Animals adapt and change to better suit the environments. The argument is whether Macro-evolution exists, because it is over a much much longer period of time and it is not certain.

But what if Christianity and evolution could get along. God could have created animals and humans with an ability to adapt, which makes alot of sense to me.

Asherlee
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Asherlee
5,001 posts
Shepherd

I feel the same Flip. Dan said that has an official stance - maybe Creation Evolutionist?

Devoidless
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Devoidless
3,675 posts
Jester

Changing things up a bit so I can get back to the 'in school' part. Which is what I really am interested in.

There is no reason to not teach evolution in schools, even more so for public schools. It has the most proof and evidence to back it up, is generally accepted everywhere as the most reasonable explanation and does not violate the separation of church and state laws.

If some private school which gets no funding from the government wants to teach some other reason to explain everything that involves a god, then so be it. But at the same time, a private school should also have the option of teaching the evolution theory alongside it. It would not be fair to the students to only fill their heads with fairy-tales and stories but no actual science. That would be akin to telling children all their lives that they can be whatever they want to be when they grow up regardless of what it is....then having all the kids wanting to be astronauts and being shot down by the rest of society.
Everyone regardless of their religious beliefs need to live at least partly in the real world.

clipmaster3
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clipmaster3
104 posts
Nomad

If Evolution has been proven noone especially the scientist that support it would still call it a theory so how can you call it truth when you still say its a theory yourself. It's impossible to prove.


Actually, as you're supposed to learn in biology or whatever your first high school science class is, a theory holds very high status... it's just called that because science is tentative, and not all details are exact or correct etc. It DOES NOT mean that there is no proof.

you can not reasonably deny the existence, or rather the process, of evolution. look at the Galapagos Islands... when Darwin went on his expedition there he cataloged many different varieties of birds (woodpeckers, etc). when he brought specimens back it turned out all of the varieties of birds were in fact finches! they had just changed form over generations to adapt to available supplies of food, etc.
redbedhead
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redbedhead
341 posts
Nomad

I don't understand these topics if EVERYONE is going to be close-minded, because I know all the athiest and evolutionsists on this site think that Christians are close-minded and Christians think that evolutionsists and athiest on this site are close-minded. Neither one of us (as in the groups) are apparently not going to change each others minds and both groups think that the other one can't prove its own state and both groups think that the others are idiots, then why are we arguing back in forth? If you really want to discuss it then go get a page at the great debate because noone seems to change the others mind.

KlNG
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KlNG
301 posts
Nomad

There is proof of evolution, and I see no problem for it being taught in schools.

If somebody doesn't agree with the "theory" of evolution, they can suck it up and get over it. You don't have to change your views on something just because its in your class circulum.

Just like how I have no appreciation for Mao Zedong, even though I wrote a 12 page term paper on him. But then again, people aren't arguing over whether Mao Zedong is real or just a "theory".

Im done.

clipmaster3
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clipmaster3
104 posts
Nomad

we also can agree that bacteria can develop resistance to antibiotics, correct? this would be evolution in the process Incorrect, actually. Although resistances are created, no other changes are made - it is the same exact creature (let us say a fly, for example), except with a resistance to a certain chemical. How does a resistance to a chemical, make new appendages, organs, bodily systems, etc?


it is not a quick process... it took billions of years to go from single-celled organisms to multiple-celled, yet still microscopic, organisms. take for example this image i found online which will help to abstractly illustrate my point...
http://www.kingtommy.com/tutorials/images/shape_tween.gif
if the animation were played in slow motion, it would look fairly circular, and as the frames gradually changed you would continue to think, "yeah... that still looks pretty circular" and wonder at what point does it finally change into a square shape. it is that same point at which one species finally turns into another.
clipmaster3
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clipmaster3
104 posts
Nomad

rofl i never thought i'd see mao zedong tied in with evolution...

hojoko
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hojoko
508 posts
Peasant

Evolution should be taught in schools. So should Christianity. Whatever someone believes, whether it be that The Bible is a fairy tale, or that Evolution is a fraud, people should have the right to know what the Theories on the world are.

I personally put more faith in Evolution, but not everyone has to. Some reasons why or why not Evolution or Creationism should be taught in schools:

--------------------------------Christianity------------------------

Why it should:
-It shows people what other people believe in, as it is a widely accepted theory.
-It gives everyone an option on what to believe.
-It is part of our cultural and scientific history.

Why it should not:
-Because it has very little evidence behind it.
-Because it might confuse some people.


-----------------------------Evolution-----------------------------

Why it should:
-It has proof behind it.
-It is part of almost every other science, so to reject evolution is to reject science.


Why it should not:
-It might insult people.
-It is not necessarily true.


I know there are many other reasons why or why not either of them should be taught. I think they should both be electives.

homegrove
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homegrove
325 posts
Peasant

I won't respond to any of those evolution versus Creationist, since as Moe pointed out there are many other threads to post such opinions on. But anyways...

I believe hojoko has the best point, overall (which may have been stated before). Evolution, Christianity, and all other religions should simply be electives, that way, whichever one a student wishes to look into, they have the opportunity to do so.

csmith995
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csmith995
42 posts
Nomad

at least evolution has proof where is the proof god exist and made everything

kanethebrain
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kanethebrain
242 posts
Nomad

@hojoko: I could agree with Christianity needing to be taught in schools. As a historical movement, it's extremely important in many eras, from the Fall of the Roman Empire, to the Dark Ages, to Religious wars, to colonization, to today. As a faith... well, there's a reason we have separation of church and state. I don't think we should teach that it's wrong: I do think that we should give students the critical thinking skills to be able to evaluate religion.

I don't think you could get away without teaching evolution without also getting rid of biology. It would be like teaching physics without gravity, chemistry without molecules, or English literature without Shakespeare.

BASHA
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BASHA
660 posts
Nomad

it is a fact kane has listed cites and clip master has a pretty good point don't deny facts:P

necromancer
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necromancer
750 posts
Peasant

This is a letter by the great prophet Bobby Henderson to the Kansas school board when they were thinking of including Intelligent Design in their curriculum-

I am writing you with much concern after having read of your hearing to decide whether the alternative theory of Intelligent Design should be taught along with the theory of Evolution. I think we can all agree that it is important for students to hear multiple viewpoints so they can choose for themselves the theory that makes the most sense to them. I am concerned, however, that students will only hear one theory of Intelligent Design.

Let us remember that there are multiple theories of Intelligent Design. I and many others around the world are of the strong belief that the universe was created by a Flying Spaghetti Monster. It was He who created all that we see and all that we feel. We feel strongly that the overwhelming scientific evidence pointing towards evolutionary processes is nothing but a coincidence, put in place by Him.

It is for this reason that Iâm writing you today, to formally request that this alternative theory be taught in your schools, along with the other two theories. In fact, I will go so far as to say, if you do not agree to do this, we will be forced to proceed with legal action. Iâm sure you see where we are coming from. If the Intelligent Design theory is not based on faith, but instead another scientific theory, as is claimed, then you must also allow our theory to be taught, as it is also based on science, not on faith.

Some find that hard to believe, so it may be helpful to tell you a little more about our beliefs. We have evidence that a Flying Spaghetti Monster created the universe. None of us, of course, were around to see it, but we have written accounts of it. We have several lengthy volumes explaining all details of His power. Also, you may be surprised to hear that there are over 10 million of us, and growing. We tend to be very secretive, as many people claim our beliefs are not substantiated by observable evidence. What these people donât understand is that He built the world to make us think the earth is older than it really is. For example, a scientist may perform a carbon-dating process on an artifact. He finds that approximately 75% of the Carbon-14 has decayed by electron emission to Nitrogen-14, and infers that this artifact is approximately 10,000 years old, as the half-life of Carbon-14 appears to be 5,730 years. But what our scientist does not realize is that every time he makes a measurement, the Flying Spaghetti Monster is there changing the results with His Noodly Appendage. We have numerous texts that describe in detail how this can be possible and the reasons why He does this. He is of course invisible and can pass through normal matter with ease.

Iâm sure you now realize how important it is that your students are taught this alternate theory. It is absolutely imperative that they realize that observable evidence is at the discretion of a Flying Spaghetti Monster. Furthermore, it is disrespectful to teach our beliefs without wearing His chosen outfit, which of course is full pirate regalia. I cannot stress the importance of this enough, and unfortunately cannot describe in detail why this must be done as I fear this letter is already becoming too long. The concise explanation is that He becomes angry if we donât.

You may be interested to know that global warming, earthquakes, hurricanes, and other natural disasters are a direct effect of the shrinking numbers of Pirates since the 1800s. For your interest, I have included a graph of the approximate number of pirates versus the average global temperature over the last 200 years. As you can see, there is a statistically significant inverse relationship between pirates and global temperature.

http://www.venganza.org/piratesarecool4.gif

In conclusion, thank you for taking the time to hear our views and beliefs. I hope I was able to convey the importance of teaching this theory to your students. We will of course be able to train the teachers in this alternate theory. I am eagerly awaiting your response, and hope dearly that no legal action will need to be taken. I think we can all look forward to the time when these three theories are given equal time in our science classrooms across the country, and eventually the world; One third time for Intelligent Design, one third time for Flying Spaghetti Monsterism, and one third time for logical conjecture based on overwhelming observable evidence.

Sincerely Yours,

Bobby Henderson, concerned citizen.

P.S. I have included an artistic drawing of Him creating a mountain, trees, and a midget. Remember, we are all His creatures.

http://www.venganza.org/him2.jpg

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