ForumsWEPR[nec]Christianity vs Atheism

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kiddslayer12
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kiddslayer12
70 posts
Nomad

I am a christian, i and i strongly belive in my lord jesus christ, and i also belive that if you belive in him and except him as your savior, u will go to heaven. and i also believe that he created the world, not the big bang, or that we came from stupid apes.

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Kyouzou
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Kyouzou
5,061 posts
Jester

I'm pretty sure my parents know, I just don't want to talk about it with them because then it becomes all kinds of awkward.

MRWalker82
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MRWalker82
4,005 posts
Shepherd

You should talk to them. Not only because they are your parents, but because it will help you understand your ideas as well as theirs better. Religion is just a matter of opinion. You find one you like or you decide you don't like any of them.

But discuss it with them. It will be awkward at first, but after a few conversations the awkwardness goes away, and a lot of times talking about a subject like religion can open the doors to being able to be more open about other things as well.

Unless they are extreme zealots then it really can't do anything but good for your relationship.

Kyouzou
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Kyouzou
5,061 posts
Jester

Unless they are extreme zealots then it really can't do anything but good for your relationship.


Not even close...religion is just not a very discussed topic in my family, unless one of us happens to be ranting about how stupid and arrogant terrorists are. (I'm not even kidding)
MageGrayWolf
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MageGrayWolf
9,462 posts
Farmer

Not even close...religion is just not a very discussed topic in my family, unless one of us happens to be ranting about how stupid and arrogant terrorists are.


I often discussed religion with my parents. When ever I would come to my dad and say I believe X he always seemed to come up with something to make me question that belief, even when it was a belief he held himself.
snipershot325
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snipershot325
844 posts
Nomad

It is good to have a religon to believe something,espicially when your a kid!plus christmas and easter if your christian!

pHacon
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pHacon
1,903 posts
Nomad

It is good to have a religon to believe something,espicially when your a kid!plus christmas and easter if your christian!

I'm no christian and I still celebrate these with my parents... It's time with them that I normally don't have for me, not something religious.
314d1
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314d1
3,817 posts
Nomad

It is good to have a religon to believe something,espicially when your a kid!plus christmas and easter if your christian!


But it won't help in your life. Believing in Santa Clause, like god, does not help you in any way. Christmas and Easter are both based off pagan holidays. If Christians can change them to fit there religion, than atheist can do the same. Except well with lack of religion instead.
AnaLoGMunKy
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AnaLoGMunKy
1,573 posts
Blacksmith

It is good to have a religon to believe something,espicially when your a kid!plus christmas and easter if your christian!


You could just as easily put the boot on the other foot and say its good NOT to have religion and THEN believe in doing good for the sake of it.
MageGrayWolf
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MageGrayWolf
9,462 posts
Farmer

It is good to have a religon to believe something,espicially when your a kid!plus christmas and easter if your christian!


Is there really benefit in believing something that's false over finding the truth? Perhaps on a individual basis there's no harm, but religion is based on groups.

But it won't help in your life. Believing in Santa Clause, like god, does not help you in any way. Christmas and Easter are both based off pagan holidays. If Christians can change them to fit there religion, than atheist can do the same. Except well with lack of religion instead.


From my understanding many atheists celebrate Christmas as a holiday about the season, which is actually closer to it's original roots then the Christian version.
NoNameC68
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NoNameC68
5,043 posts
Shepherd

Is there really benefit in believing something that's false over finding the truth? Perhaps on a individual basis there's no harm, but religion is based on groups.


There's no benefit that can't be had with truth, but this is not reason to dismiss religion. Religion often brings people together so they can socialize. Religion can also be used to mend relationships and to build morals.

Sure, you don't NEED religion to do the above, but what good is the truth if you don't care about it? Some of us seek the truth, while others seek happiness, even if it means living under the shade.

Many good people live their lives believing in a god, and they live happy lives. Religion does good things for people, and yes, even some bad.

Religion is not required to be happy, but it does help some people. If I am happy believing in God, why should I accept the truth that there isn't one? What reason is there? If I live as a mechanic and raise a family, it wouldn't matter if I believed in the Big Bang over God, it wouldn't benefit me at all.

People who believe in God aren't close minded with science unless it challenges God. Therefore, many theists act out with logic in most situations. Most theists will follow scientific formulas that don't clash with God, which most don't.

I read the book Brave New World. If you have not read it, do so. If you have, simply tell me what you thought of the book and which society you would rather be born under.
Avorne
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Avorne
3,085 posts
Nomad

It's the clashing with God part that I really can't stand. No matter how small a difference it makes NO ONE should become close-minded to science simply because it clashes with religion and the reverse applies. I've studied religion throughout my whole life and i've never once discredited something simply 'because it's religious' - I have always thought in-depth about religious concepts before coming to a conclusion - if that conclusion changes the way I perceive science then so be it. All I'm asking is that religious people approach science in that way too.

MageGrayWolf
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MageGrayWolf
9,462 posts
Farmer

Sure, you don't NEED religion to do the above,


If we can achieve all these things without the negative baggage religion also brings then what purpose does it really serve?

but what good is the truth if you don't care about it?


Not caring about the truth in a group think I would say is very problematic, and potentially dangerous.

Some of us seek the truth, while others seek happiness, even if it means living under the shade.


You say that almost as if the two were exclusive. Pretty sure that's not how you meant it though.
Here's a sound bite to consider on the point of happiness and religion.
Atheists, theists and happiness

If I am happy believing in God, why should I accept the truth that there isn't one? What reason is there? If I live as a mechanic and raise a family, it wouldn't matter if I believed in the Big Bang over God, it wouldn't benefit me at all.


On an individual basis perhaps, but again if it goes beyond that it can become problematic. For instance if that mechanics children wanted to get into a field of work that would require the practical applications of the Big Bang theory, religion now puts them at a disadvantage and possibly at odds with their family.

People who believe in God aren't close minded with science unless it challenges God.


What Avorne said.

I read the book Brave New World. If you have not read it, do so. If you have, simply tell me what you thought of the book and which society you would rather be born under.


I haven't read it yet but it's on my list.
NoNameC68
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NoNameC68
5,043 posts
Shepherd

I remember watching the video you linked. I actually have to disagree with League of Reason in some regards.

One of them mentioned that it was like saying a drunk is happier than a sober man, which is not necessarily true, and I agree with this. In the same regard, a sober man is not necessarily happier than a drunk man. It's just not comparable. You can be happy drunk as well as happy sober.

It is possible to be a responsible drunk, as much as it is possible to be a responsible theist. Some people get out of hand and do stupid things, while others stay in place, stay out of cars, and stay out off the political stage.

On an individual basis perhaps, but again if it goes beyond that it can become problematic. For instance if that mechanics children wanted to get into a field of work that would require the practical applications of the Big Bang theory, religion now puts them at a disadvantage and possibly at odds with their family.


This is very true, and unfortunate. However, there's also a chance the children will convert to atheism themselves, even if they aren't open about it to their family, or that they will remain theists and choose a field that does not clash with their religion.

Great things are seldom, if ever, perfect. Religion and the good it brings will come with problems. People love beer and alcohol, and they use alcohol as a way to socially connect to people. Of course it's possible to connect to people without bringing a cooler of beer or a bag of wine, but it does bring people together. Rather than telling people they shouldn't drink alcohol because of the obvious problems it may cause, I explain to people how they may drink alcohol, but remain responsible.

Of course, it's not that black and white. However, that's the best way I can explain my position and my approach to the problem.

Don't get me wrong. I believe it's important for atheists to challenge theists and their views. As much as it drives me crazy, and as much as I speak against it, I believe it's important for atheists to declare a type of "war" against theism.

So, to put it all in a nut shell, despite the problems religion causes, I support it. I would rather be in an ongoing struggle trying to eradicate the negatives of religion while preserving the positives, than to eradicate religion all together. You may think that this is nothing more than a waste of time, but if you look how much more open minded your average Christian is today than those from 200 years ago, you will see that we have made some progress. There are still powerful enemies against science and reason in politics, such as the Vatican, but again, I feel we can eradicate these problems while preserving the positives of religion.
Avorne
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Avorne
3,085 posts
Nomad

And there's the thing - religion does bring problems. Why not just be Atheistic in your beliefs? After all, there are no downsides to it. As you pointed out - you don't need religion for socializing, morals, etc. and so it serves no real purpose.

Sociophobic
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Sociophobic
34 posts
Nomad

We can never really be sure if we're right or not so no since worrying too much, in my opinion.

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