ForumsWEPR[concluded] Was Jesus real?

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holt24
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holt24
1,133 posts
Nomad

This is not about whether or not he was the son of God but whether he actually existed.Most atheists agree that he did live but there are some who don't so what are you're thoughts?

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samy
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samy
4,871 posts
Nomad

Mostly i'd say it's up to God because it's him doing the judging and not us


Well yes, but shouldn't the bible provide an answer into this?

And didn't Jesus tell the murderer on the cross that he would be in paradise when he died?
cowmaster1
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cowmaster1
676 posts
Shepherd

Who esle would do the judging? It seems like common sense to me.

Yeah Jesus did. But Jesus is God.

Cinna
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Cinna
753 posts
Nomad

What IS evil Samy?

samy
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samy
4,871 posts
Nomad

But Jesus is God.


If Jesus were to break his own rules I feel Christianity would be pointless.

What IS evil Samy?


The lack of good.
Cinna
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Cinna
753 posts
Nomad

Well then what is good?

samy
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samy
4,871 posts
Nomad

Well then what is good?


Although there may be an objective definition of good we don't know it as of yet.

Now if we are to return to the plane of debating Christianity I'll make the statement that for god to be only love/good then all his actions must reflect that. So, we can say that the opposite actions are evil and should be the devils, things like not flooding the Earth or banishing people to ****ation would be considered evil.
samy
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samy
4,871 posts
Nomad

Well then what is good?


Although there may be an objective definition of good we don't know it as of yet.

Now if we are to return to the plane of debating Christianity I'll make the statement that for god to be only love/good then all his actions must reflect that. So, we can say that the opposite actions are evil and should be the devils, things like not flooding the Earth or banishing people to ****ation would be considered evil if we were to say god is only good.
MageGrayWolf
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MageGrayWolf
9,462 posts
Farmer

If you're going to hell you're beyond help, which makes no sense when your God is omnipotent.


Also doesn't make any sense considering what you claimed to be the requirement of going there.


[quote]What of someone who never heard the word of god?


Thats the exception/crazy example that i was talking about. Its not my call.[/quote]

"After the priest got done telling the Eskimo about God the Eskimo turned and asked "would I go to hell if I never heard of any of this?" The priest said "No". The Eskimo replied "Then why did you tell me?"."

Ironically, many Native American religions were found to resemble Christianity.


Most Native American religions are pantheistic.

From wiki
"Pantheism is the view that the Universe (Nature) and God are identical. Pantheists thus do not believe in a personal, anthropomorphic or creator god."

Such hints of pantheism in Christianity are really more recent developments as science progressed forcing such a being to have to exist in such a way in order for people to continue to claim he does.

Really the idea of nature=God is more in line with pagan beliefs

How could they coPy the europeans, who they had never seen?


Easy they didn't.

Demons don't believe. They know.


Ah yes the whole knowledge is bad argument again.

Anyways, it couldn't be that they turned away from God. Angels have seen God so when they turn away from God, there is no going back.


Thinking about it the whole story of Satan contradicts the eternity of heaven. So if it's possible to turn away from heaven but not hell, this just makes it an even worse system.

If you turn back to God before you die, you'll be saved.


Why can't that work after I die?

I doubt that in every case of rebellion it is for a worthy cause. Besides, you apparently reject God, yet here you and other atheists debate on his character. It's like us talking about the morality of the tooth fairy.


If people surrounding me kept talking about the tooth fairy as being real, tried to use deceptive methods to get such unfounded ideas into schools and in laws, and went on about the bad stuff that will happen if I don't believe in the tooth fairy, your **** right I'd argue against it.

That's not really biblical, well it is in some books and not in others.


Got to like how the Bible nnneeevvveeerrr contradicts it self.

Yeah Jesus did. But Jesus is God.


Then why or even how could this happen?

Mark 15:34 (NIV)
And at the ninth hour Jesus cried out in a loud voice, "Eloi, Eloi, lama sabachthani?"--which means, "My God, my God, why have you forsaken me?"
cowmaster1
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cowmaster1
676 posts
Shepherd

Such hints of pantheism in Christianity are really more recent developments as science progressed forcing such a being to have to exist in such a way in order for people to continue to claim he does.

What hints? I have no idea what you are talking about


My God, my God, why have you forsaken me?"

Jesus is quoting psalm 22. He is proclaiming his faith
Asherlee
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Asherlee
5,001 posts
Shepherd

You said that the Native American religions resemble Christianity. And Mage's response was most of those religions are pantheistic. Then, said that Christianity having characteristics of pantheism is a recent development.

He's stating facts for you.

MRWalker82
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MRWalker82
4,005 posts
Shepherd

Actually, if you really want to get into the 'realism' of Jesus and the things attributed to his life you might want to take a look at the Hindu lore of Krishna, as well as the Egyptian myths surrounding Horus' life. I find it rather eerie that both the Hindi and Egyptian myths both predate, and parallel, the myths of Jesus. Just food for thought.

Asherlee
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Asherlee
5,001 posts
Shepherd

Oooo, I found a quick chart to list some of the similarities. However, I'm a little unsure of the reliability of this website. But, nonetheless I'm going to give the link to the chart.

http://www.religioustolerance.org/chr_jcpa5b.htm

MageGrayWolf
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MageGrayWolf
9,462 posts
Farmer

Jesus is quoting psalm 22. He is proclaiming his faith


That still doesn't make any sense why he would say that if he is God.
slimmyfeet
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slimmyfeet
59 posts
Nomad

Jesus is God's son. He is god in the sense that he is perfect and is pure good.

That still doesn't make any sense why he would say that if he is God.
He said that becuase God wasnt relieving any of the pain that he was suffering.
MRWalker82
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MRWalker82
4,005 posts
Shepherd

Jesus is God's son. He is god in the sense that he is perfect and is pure good.


Wait, so is he god or not? Seriously. Let's try to be concise here.
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