Forums → WEPR → Theism and Atheism
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I grew up atheist for 16 years. I had always kept an open mind towards religion, but never really felt a need to believe in it. My sister started going to a Wednesday night children's program at a church. Eventually, I was dragged into a Christmas Eve service. Scoffing, I reluctantly went, assuming that this was going to be a load of crap, but when I went, I felt something. Something that I've never felt before. I felt a sense of empowerment and a sense of calling. Jesus called upon my soul, just like he did with his disciples. he wanted me to follow him. Now, my life is being lived for Christ. He died on the cross for my sins, and the sins of everyone who believes in him. He was beaten, brutalized, struck with a whip 39 times, made to carry a cross up to the stage of his death. This I believe to be true, and I can never repay him for what he has done.
I still have my struggles with Christianity, but I've found this bit of information most useful. Religion is not comprehensible in the human mind, because we cannot comprehend the idea of a perfect and supreme being, a God, but we can believe it in our heart, and that's the idea of faith. Faith is, even though everything rides against me believing in Jesus, I still believe in him because I know that it's true in my heart. I invite my fellow Brothers and sisters of the LORD to talk about how Jesus has helped you in your life. No atheists and no insults please
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Here's one
Forgive me for not putting the pic up directly, I can never get them to work on this site without screwing it up 200 times.
Here's one
Lol, isn't that more of a circle made of squares?
Forgive me for not putting the pic up directly, I can never get them to work on this site without screwing it up 200 times.
Copy link, click Image, paste link into box, click OK
Actually the more I look at it it's actually forming a nonahedron.
Lol, isn't that more of a circle made of squares?
Semantics my good friend.
Anyways...
Find me a worm that can understand the ways of men.
A worm maybe not, they are simply incapable of it. However, there are monkeys that have been trained to speak sign language and communicate their feelings.
Playing devils advocate for the sake of good debate.
Can you provide evidence, proof or anything else to support your claim Kasic?
- H
A worm maybe not, they are simply incapable of it.
And we are simply incapable of understanding his ways. *God
A worm maybe not, they are simply incapable of it.
And we are simply incapable of understanding his ways. *God
Or, there simply is no god and it's just a archaic superstittion and is pathetic that we still cling to it. Plus, worms don't think -at all- I believe, we do. Do you see worms launching themselves into space?
No, because there not as smart as us. Kind of like us compared to God. See, you think you know everything because we are the superior being on this planet, well that's what the shark thinks, since he's pretty much the superior being in the water. He thinks before he devours other fish. So obviously animals are capable of thoughts. Do you see sharks in a water rocket ship launching themselves into space? Nope. So in a way, we are the animals, and he is the superior human, from a perspective.
No, because there not as smart as us. Kind of like us compared to God. See, you think you know everything because we are the superior being on this planet
No we don't think we know everything. We admit there are gaps in our knowledge. However with the religious mindset instead of doing the intellectually honest things and admitting this you simply insert God into those gaps. Even when that gap gets filled you refuse to accept it and continue to use your preconceived conclusion.
This is just the sort of argument I was addressing with that picture I posted in my very first post in this thread. It's people telling us what God thinks and knows then turning around and saying we can't know such things. Basically your just making yourself sound like you made up the whole **** thing.
See, you think you know everything because we are the superior being on this planet, well that's what the shark thinks, since he's pretty much the superior being in the water. He thinks before he devours other fish. So obviously animals are capable of thoughts.
Or instinct? Just look at the size of their brain. They might as well be a T-Rex with comparison.
he is the superior human, from a perspective.
Exactly what perspective?
Oh and I haven't heard a response from Shift XD
Convenient that asking God to do anything at all is a sin. It's almost like he doesn't exist...
Aren't you basically asking God to do things when you pray?I repeat. Requesting is fine, as long as you accept that you might not receive what you request. Demanding is not.
It would seem we can ask anything we want and it will be done. Yet this isn't what we see happening. We get excuses that the answer is yes, later, or no. But that's not what it says.Later, right. However, sometimes it does happen at once.
That doesn't mean you get to insert God into the gaps of our knowledge and claim to know something you don't.I think I haven't said anything that states that "God directly causes this and that", I did state that "God is ultimately beyond any event happening, at least by designing laws so that they should happen this way". This allows researching anything and everything, as long as you remain in consonance with God's words. (This makes experiments on the unwilling banned, including IVF and some others)
Communism and atheism aren't the same thing.In Soviet Russia... communists forced God out of the country, so I can state that HERE all communists were atheists, because they are taught so. Some retain this status after 1991 despite the restoration of Orthodox Church and other religious-based initiatives running here.
Since we can rule out the sun actually moving our next best option is an optical illusion.You have not said "next best" back ther, you said "it is", therefore "the only other way it could be...", THIS is closed-mindedness.
Scientific theories have to be falsifiable, this allows them to be modified or discarded with the introduction of new evidence. Religious beliefs however do not operate this way. They will hold on to the claim regardless of or even against the evidence presented.You are shifting meanings here. You cannot disprove SCIENCE as a whole, while parts of it can be modified. You cannot disprove RELIGION as a whole, while parts of it can, too, be modified, say Second Vatican Council changed a lot, but the base of Christianity is still the same.
They are asking for God to prove he is actually God and is there. Quite like how I and many other atheists have been ASKING for.This does not mean that God will agree to display you that He is here EVERY TIME you ask.
So again, really no reason to debate a stalemate.Well, there are people who think their grounds are not moving, so debating with them is pointless. But there are still people that are not that sturdy, so providing some evidence of God and His love to them might awaken them and they will believe or at least start to seek God themselves. If there was or will be at least one who would feel his heart move, this debate is not pointless.
display you that He is here EVERY TIME you ask.
I wouldn't expect him to. But you'd think, that, just once, he'd at least do SOMETHING. I have asked him before...nada. Asked him again some time later...nothing. Not even something you -might- be able to construe as a sign from him...they were all ordinary days, and nothing that has ever happened in my life has led me to believe that there just -might- be a god.
I repeat. Requesting is fine, as long as you accept that you might not receive what you request. Demanding is not.
What you're saying is that if you ask God, who may or may not exist, to let something happen, it may or may not happen.
If God has planned out everything from the beginning, which I'm assuming is your belief since you have defended a perfect God (correct me if I'm wrong), how can our prayers have any effect or even matter if God already planned out everything?
This does not mean that God will agree to display you that He is here EVERY TIME you ask.
But it does mean that God will NEVER display to you that he is here?
It's fine if God doesn't want to grant me a prayer like "I wish I had enough money to buy drugs" or something ultimately harmful to me in the long run. But if God doesn't reveal himself to the non-believers, they will not believe, and he knows this. If they continue to be non-believers, regardless of how good or bad they were in the world, he will condemn them to a place where they will be tortured forever.
Hell is bad for us in the long run, from what I hear. So it would be nice to answer this kind of prayer, if he exists.
Well, there are people who think their grounds are not moving, so debating with them is pointless. But there are still people that are not that sturdy, so providing some evidence of God and His love to them might awaken them and they will believe or at least start to seek God themselves. If there was or will be at least one who would feel his heart move, this debate is not pointless.
I'd have to agree with you on the point that the debate is not pointless. Even if we don't change our opinions, it isn't harmful to discuss our beliefs or non-beliefs. It can only help us to become more knowledgable on the topics.
If God has planned out everything from the beginning, which I'm assuming is your belief since you have defended a perfect God (correct me if I'm wrong), how can our prayers have any effect or even matter if God already planned out everything?
Just because God knows what we will chose, does not mean we are not responsible for chosing the right path.
Deuteronomy 30:15 "See, I have set before you today life and good,
death and evil, 16 "in that I command you today to love the Lord your
God, to walk in His ways, and to keep His commandments, His statutes,
and His judgments, that you may live and multiply; and the Lord your
God will bless you in the land which you go to possess. 17 "But if
your heart turns away so that you do not hear, and are drawn away, and worship other gods and serve them, 18 "I announce to you today that you shall surely perish; you shall not prolong [your] days in the land which you cross over the Jordan to go in and possess. 19 "I call heaven and earth as witnesses today against you, [that] I have set before you life and death, blessing and cursing; therefore choose
life, that both you and your descendants may live.
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