ForumsWEPRBuilding a Mosque at Ground Zero

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mdv96
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mdv96
1,017 posts
Nomad

What do you think about this? I feel that it should not be built at ground zero because I find that extremely disrespectful to the families and victims of that infamous day.

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Moegreche
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Moegreche
3,826 posts
Duke

If your argument is that the people who where responsible where of Islamic belief, I still cannot find justification in your irrational protest. These groups of people are obviously extremists of there religion.


Fundamentally and philosophically, I completely agree with you. But on a practical level, I cannot.

My first point is that these people are, in fact, Muslims. Yes, they're radicalized. True, moderate Muslims do not want to acknowledge these people are part of their faith. But the simple fact is they are.
Think about what it takes to be a Christian versus, say, a Jew. For starters, a Christian must accept that Jesus Christ existed and was in fact the son of God - the messiah. Presumably, they must also follow certain dogmas within the religion, typically found in their respective holy book.
For those in the Islamic faith, the situation is similar. A Muslim would not accept that Jesus was the messiah, they would assent to the prophecies revealed by Mohamed, and they would follow certain particular dogmas.
Islam is a newer faith than either Christianity or Judaism, and like other religions it goes through certain phases. Would you call the Christians who committed atrocious acts in the name of God during the Crusades not real Christians? Of course not. They were simply following what the Bible told them to do - to kill infidels.
The Koran is quite similar to the Old Testament of the Bible and also has instructions for what to do about nonbelievers. In both texts, there are references to not suffering non-believers to live. So while our societal standards have changed since the Crusades, the messages within these religions is changing at a different pace.

But ultimately, the Islamic community must be sensitive to the feelings of those people where they want to build their Islamic center, and to the tragedy that happened - even though it was almost a decade ago.
My real worry here is that the response on a local level is going to be quite filled with opposition. The uneducated Americans who can't understand that most Muslims completely disagree with what happened on 9/11. With this opposition, there will undoubtedly be those individuals within the Islamic community who feel marginalized. And that's perhaps the first major step towards becoming radicalized.

On a practical level, this decision seems irresponsible.
nevetsthereaper
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nevetsthereaper
641 posts
Nomad

i do understand its their constitutional right to do it. but there are so many loopholes in our judicial and constitutional systems, that it makes it too easy for mususe and abuse. its their right of course. its still not right.

Saving123
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Saving123
1,258 posts
Nomad

I see nothing wrong with this. They are building it a little bit away. To deny this would be to deny them religious freedom. Blah Blah Blah you've heard it all before.

nevetsthereaper
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nevetsthereaper
641 posts
Nomad

we can all have our opinions on this, doesnt change the fact that its going thru. but still, to me i don't agree with it.

Fairylord
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Fairylord
12 posts
Nomad

On a practical level, this decision seems irresponsible.


It is, and I find it very hard to believe that the people in charge of this don't know that.

we can all have our opinions on this, doesnt change the fact that its going thru.


Sadly, yes. Something is bound to go wrong, and the only people who can rightly stop a tragedy before it happens are the Muslims in charge of the mosque. I really doubt that's going to happen.
TheTerminator
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TheTerminator
174 posts
Nomad

They should not build one that is soooo disrespectful its like building the Nazi party headquarters at Aushwitz.
That is the most ignorant statement I have heard in my entire life. It's sad that we have so many ignorant people poisening our society.
SeaTurtle
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SeaTurtle
116 posts
Nomad

Ok Terminator perhaps it is more like building an American Restraunt on the site of the Hiroshima bomb drop.

Nightfang21
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Nightfang21
117 posts
Nomad

I think its the stupidest idea ever. Your constructing a building full of worshipers that killed over 2000 inoccent men and women all because we arnt Muslim. It got me even more upset that the stupid President supports the plan. We have the weakest President ever that will kiss up to anyone just so nothing bad will happen....Yea thats what i think and idc if you disagree.

sickcroon
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sickcroon
151 posts
Nomad

Some information.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/yblog_upshot/20100816/pl_yblog_upshot/news-outlets-split-in-describing-mosque

Avorne
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Avorne
3,085 posts
Nomad

Some people are so ignorant, bigoted and close-minded. Y'know what - they aren't building the Mosque on top of Ground Zero - It's 2 damn blocks away! What is the harm in that? New York has quite a large Muslim community and I think a nice, shiny and new Mosque is a good idea. How can you call the president weak-minded? Is it weak to stand up against a torrent of bigoted, gap-toothed rednecks and say 'I support freedom of religion and I will do the right thing no matter what'.

Avorne
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Avorne
3,085 posts
Nomad

Some people are so ignorant, bigoted and close-minded. Y'know what - they aren't building the Mosque on top of Ground Zero - It's 2 damn blocks away! What is the harm in that? New York has quite a large Muslim community and I think a nice, shiny and new Mosque is a good idea. How can you call the president weak-minded? Is it weak to stand up against a torrent of bigoted, gap-toothed rednecks and say 'I support freedom of religion and I will do the right thing no matter what'.

nevetsthereaper
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nevetsthereaper
641 posts
Nomad

i love the woman at the top with the sign: 'islam builds mosques at the sites of their conquests and victories'. classic.

Saving123
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Saving123
1,258 posts
Nomad

If they were to build it near any other historic site that we adore there would be no problem with it. But since they are building it near something that the radical muslims did, not saying that all of the muslims that want to build it aren't radical, some may be, not the peaceful ones. Frankly it's just rascist if they don't let them.

Freakenstein
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Freakenstein
9,504 posts
Jester

Your constructing a building full of worshipers that killed over 2000 inoccent men and women all because we arnt Muslim.


I'm sorry you feel that way, even though they were EXTREMIST Muslim. Do the peaceful, normal Muslims want anything to do with this mess? I don't think so.

But since they are building it near something that the radical muslims did, not saying that all of the muslims that want to build it aren't radical, some may be, not the peaceful ones.


If the EXTREMISTS hate us so bad, I don't think they'd want to go in a Mosque in U.S. territory.
Moegreche
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Moegreche
3,826 posts
Duke

Y'know what - they aren't building the Mosque on top of Ground Zero - It's 2 **** blocks away! What is the harm in that? New York has quite a large Muslim community and I think a nice, shiny and new Mosque is a good idea.


Let's be clear - the political ramifications were made clear by those who first proposed the Islamic center. They said they wanted to build it close to ground zero as a tribute to the victims.
Now, this move may very well have been laced with the best of intentions, but that's not how it's being perceived. And for anyone in the world to be surprised at the ignorance and closed-mindedness of Americans would be surprising in itself.
Simply put, this new Islamic center will not have the desired goals it was proposed to have. Many family members and friends of victims have spoken out adamantly against its construction.
And because there are people who feel threatened and harassed by this, the First Amendment issues become secondary. And keep in mind this threat or harassment doesn't have to be actual - it can be merely a perceived threat.
I would assume if this line of argumentation (i.e., that building an Islamic center near ground zero is threatening or harassing) can be refuted, then there's really no solid argument against its construction.

Still, even if its construction is constitutionally protected, that doesn't mean it should be done. The point I made earlier, I think, still stands: the fierce opposition to this Islamic center would risk only further marginalizing members of the Islamic community. And that can, and has, lead to radicalization.
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